NPR's Ayesha Rascoe asks former federal prosecutor Mary McCord about the Trump administration's vow to prosecute domestic terrorists and "Antifa."

The Trump administration has vowed to go after protesters officials say are part of antifa groups. Antifa is short for anti-fascist, a far-left movement or ideology. Last week, eight people were sentenced to prison terms as long as 100 years after a violent protest outside the Prairieland ICE detention center in Alvarado, Texas, in July 2025. Joining us now is Mary McCord, a former acting assistant attorney general for national security at the Department of Justice. She's currently a professor at Georgetown Law. Thank you for being here.

RASCOE: After the assassination of Charlie Kirk last year, President Trump put out a document designating antifa as a domestic terrorism organization. Remind us what that memorandum does.

MCCORD: In legal effect, it does nothing because Congress has not created any statutory scheme for designating domestic terrorist organizations. We have a statutory scheme for designating foreign terrorist organizations because foreign organizations don't have First Amendment rights. Congress has never done that for domestic organizations.

So what this really is is just a label, a label that the president decided he wanted to put on to certain groups or even groups that are not groups like antifa, which is an ideology, really to send a message - we're looking at you. We're targeting you. It has no legal effect. There is no crime associated with being labeled by the president a domestic terrorist organization, but it does send a message.

RASCOE: Well, what do you make of these sentences in Texas? And we should be clear - this was not a peaceful protest. Like, one of the protesters was convicted of shooting and injuring an officer, but these were extremely long prison sentences.

MCCORD: These sentences are really shocking. And you're right, Ayesha, there was an act of violence. One of the alleged coconspirators did shoot at a local police official and injured that official, and that is serious. That is a violent crime, and I'm not at all surprised that that person was charged. But the charges extended beyond that person to this group of eight people. And I think what the government had tried to do in the indictment and what apparently Judges O'Connor and Judge Pittman have done through their sentences is convey something more than just, this was a protest where a few people involved in that protest engaged in vandalism and acts of violence because it was really painted to be terrorist cell engaged in terrorism, and that's the way I think these judges approached it.

RASCOE: Is there something to what the judges are saying, or do you feel like they are - they're going too far by just saying, if you're anti-ICE, then somehow you're antifa or somehow you're a domestic terrorist?

MCCORD: There are domestic organizations that do advocate for and engage in acts of violence. And in fact, let's think about January 6, right? There were militia organizations that advocated for a violent attack on the U.S. Capitol. The longest sentence there was 22 years. The sentence of the shooter in the Prairieland case was 100 years. Sentences of other people who did not personally engage in that act of violence - 50 years.

And our history in America shows that the lethality from violence by those who hold white supremacist views far exceeds the lethality of violence from more leftist organizations. But this skewing of all of the government's resources to one side of the ideological spectrum - that is what infringes First Amendment rights.

RASCOE: Well, earlier this month, federal prosecutors in Minnesota brought charges against 15 people accused of impeding federal officers, part of an alleged antifa plot. But other cases like that have been dismissed recently. How do you see this playing out around the country?

MCCORD: In Minnesota, much of what is in that indictment is completely First Amendment-protected. It is First Amendment-protected to protest, to have signs, to chant. It is First Amendment-protected to record public officials, police and ICE agents doing their job in public. It's not protected to engage in physical blockades of ICE officers. And that is also included in that indictment. That, you know, if proven, may be valid charges. But I think if you read the whole thing, it looks very much like just this effort and attempt to suppress dissent.

RASCOE: So at a White House roundtable last year, President Trump accused the Biden administration of targeting Christians and, quote, "patriotic Americans" as domestic extremists. Is Trump's administration doing the same thing that previous presidents have done?

MCCORD: No, I don't think so. I mean, if what that particular comment reflected was the January 6 prosecutions or prosecutions of people who violated the FACE Act - that's the Freedom of Access to Clinics Act. That's for people who, you know, sort of violently and physically block access to reproductive healthcare clinics - you know, those types of prosecutions are based in law. I worked under presidents - Republican presidents and Democratic presidents, and, you know, you prosecuted things based on the conduct that violated criminal law, regardless of the ideology. But when you target one side of the ideological spectrum, that just raises some very, very serious concerns.

RASCOE: That's former federal prosecutor Mary McCord. Thank you so much for joining us.

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